Atheist Quotes
Morbus Iff — Sat, 2006-12-02 20:18
A large collection of atheist quotes. Some of my favorites:
- "I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours." --Stephen Roberts
- "When I was a kid I used to pray every night for a new bicycle. Then I realised that the Lord doesn't work that way so I stole one and asked Him to forgive me." --Emo Philips
- "Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" --Epicurus
- "We must question the story logic of having an all-knowing all-powerful God, who creates faulty Humans, and then blames them for his own mistakes." --Gene Roddenberry
- "We must respect the other fellow's religion, but only in the sense and to the extent that we respect his theory that his wife is beautiful and his children smart." --H. L. Mencken
- "Jesus' last words on the cross, "My God, my God, why hast thou forsaken me?" hardly seem like the words of a man who planned it that way. It doesn't take Sherlock Holmes to figure there is something wrong here." --Donald Morgan
- "Everything is more or less organized matter. To think so is against religion, but I think so just the same. When did I realize I was God? Well, I was praying and I suddenly realized I was talking to myself." --Peter O'Toole
- "Why should I allow that same God to tell me how to raise my kids, who had to drown His own?" --Robert G. Ingersoll
- "The essence of Christianity is told us in the Garden of Eden history. The fruit that was forbidden was on the tree of knowledge. The subtext is, All the suffering you have is because you wanted to find out what was going on." --Frank Zappa
- Eskimo: "If I did not know about God and sin, would I go to hell?" Priest: "No, not if you did not know." Eskimo: "Then why did you tell me?" --Annie Dillard, 'Pilgrim at Tinker Creek'
- 77870 reads
David Hume, famous atheist on his deathbed "I am in flames". His desperation was a terrible scene
Sir Thomas Scott on his deathbed..."Up to this time I have believed there is no God, neither Hell. Now I believe there are both and I am delivered to perdition by the righteous judgement of Almighty God".
Re: B Brown's comments:
Well if that is not proof there is a god I don't know what is!
Actually, it shows that belief in god is emotionally laden. Which is why some people NEED to believe in god and therefore perpetuate its existence.
Neither of these ever happened. You are a liar.
must be a Christian
lol must be
Dude. Seriously.
ON their deathbeds? How could they possibly be experiencing hell/flames/perdition before being dead?
This is just another example of christians making up athiest-repenting-on-deathbed stories. Even if an athiest were to 'have an epiphany' on their deathbed, it would not be proof of the existence of god. It would simply be a manifestation of the natural human fear of death... the same thing that led our cave-dwelling ancestors to come up with the idea of an afterlife in the first place.
In relation to this, how come we never hear stories of muslim/buddhist/hindu/pagan/etc. deathbed conversions to christianity?
In addition to your last statement, as more of a question, do other countries (where other religions are prominent other than christianity) have non-believers who, on their deathbeds, convert to islam? or hindu? i'm not going to use buddhism here, though i suppose i could, so that the person dying could find relief in the idea of being reincarnated. Just some thoughts.
For that matter, how come we never see athiests blast believers other than Christians? Must be getting to them a bit to be so vehenemently against a god they don't even believe in. That seems evidence itself of the insanity of Atheism. Offended by a god they don't believe exists. Hmmm.
Actually, most atheists attack christians because most of us have more personal experience with them. Me, I know christians, muslims, and jews enough to attack them all.
Wow. What an incredibly unenlightened statement. True atheists disavow all religions, not just Christianity, as we realize that we as a people have outgrown the need to believe in talking snakes and the like. Christianity is simply the one that we get assaulted by the most. As an unashamed atheist, I will say that I never go out of my way to squash another person's faith. If you want to believe in magic genies, so be it. However, when I am verbally assailed by another for my convictions, they find me more than able to defend myself.
We're not offended by your make-believe god. We're offended by you.
I will be completely honest Im bothered more by christians because in theory I was supposed to be christian according to location, teaching and im surrounded by them. So i know first hand the horrible things they teach people and their view on anyone else who disagrees. When two crazy people think they are performing and exersism on your mother who is really having a seizure and sit on the phone refusing to let you dial 911, I think its only human nature to hold a grudge. I can honestly say those devoute to god women are the ones who opened my eyes, the devil or evil sprirt was not leaving her soul, she was haveing withdrawls.... thats simple fact. When your insane beliefs cause unessesary deaths maybe you need to start re-thinking your "logic" and who is in so much denial of reality - no matter how unpleasant nonexistance after death maybe. I didnt exist you didnt exist before you were born why would you continue to..... think about it religious ppl. And blind faith is just rediculos. Might as well just cross your fingers itll do as much good. Why would god create a sinner and damn him for sinning? Why do catholics pray to mary? people just make up what makes them feel better thats why there are so many religions if there was a god we would all know it and all have the same one. Instead ppl make up there own and delude themselves. I guess its all the same in the end for all of us, just dont make what life I have left miserable because your in denial.
You just said: "you didnt exist before you were born why would you continue to..."
If you didn't exist before birth, and now you do, it is safe to say that you came from a non-existent state into this one. If you, in death are returning to a non-existent state then it is safe to say that that state is similar to the one you were in before you were born. If you came from non-existence into existence, and then you go back to non-existence, why is it even far-fetched to believe that you may once again return from non-existence? After all, you already pulled this trick off once, now haven't you?
The reason for him first coming into existence is well explained by science. It isn't that much of a trick. Y'know, his parents had sex, pregnancy ensued, and they had a baby. Once he dies and re-enters his state of non-existence, there isn't any logical reason to think that he'll magically come back to life. There's no way for him to be physically born again, or reanimated, so it is actually quite far-fetched to believe that you'd randomly return from non-existence after death.
Um...saying that you "will be completely honest" doesn't necessarily equate or prove truth more than me saying "I will be completely honest, there is a God" will prove it either. Second, you speak of "first hand horrible things" that "they teach" and "their view on anyone else who disagrees". Ok, you can't be referring to THE evangelical, born-again Christianity that I know because in all my years I have yet to see this where I've congregated and be condoned. Anyone who lives doing objectively moral (hmm, I wonder where we get that from?) wrong, isn't much of a Christian. Just because you had an experience with "people" (not God) doesn't discredit what Christianity IS; those two people were beyond crazy, and it's too bad that there are "people" like that. People that don't understand the Gospel and believe what they are doing is right without proof or authority from Scripture; sort of like atheism. It's too bad that your mother encountered such "people" and didn't encounter REAL Christians to attempt to help her and not automatically assume she was possesed.
We can both agree that your "insane beliefs" argument is a bit unclear; and there are Dr. with much more "logic" than me and you that have unrefuted arguments to prove God's existence (this is better than some organism riding on the back of "crystals", lol). What I mean by the former statement is that I can just as well say YOUR insane beliefs cause unnecessary deaths (Hitler), therefore you should start re-thinking YOUR "logic". You see your error? Besides, it's not even a proper argument; can a "belief" cause death? I believe that God exists, therefore..um..err..that will cause you to die...unnecessarily?!? :-S.
To sum this up (because I don't believe you will want to "reason" for an alternative to your thought, which I've already considered and didn't make sense), you are ABSOLUTELY wrong about "blind faith", that's just your assumption because "blind faith" IS ridiculous. You're also wrong about God creating a sinner, where do you get your info...you don't believe in God, so it isn't the Bible; that means you're getting a misinterpreted message from US, the ones who DO believe in God -- but we NEVER said God MADE us sinners. Regardless of how you attack this (because some atheist quotes are soooo cool), Adam had a choice and he made the wrong one...we chose sin.
hitler was actually a very religious person dumbass check your facts
definition of atheist is someone that read the bible and understood it. I can see from your post you haven't actually finished this fictional work have you? Putting it bluntly ---your buy bull god is ridiculously evil and a liar. here's proof --Please read your ten commandments completely .. Now what is the punishment for working on the sabbath? yes correct you deserve to be Stoned to death . As a matter of fact If your child back talks you you should lead them to the out skirts of town and ... Bingo !! stone them to death . It's ok to beat your slaves as long as they heal up ,but don't kill them . It also states it's ok to sell your daughter into slavery which is good cause I got one I just need the going rate so I can get maximum "prophet"..
Now for the ultimate LIE from your god " I sent my only son to die for your sins " Lets look at this .. Adam didn't actually sin but eve did and adam stuck by her side , so he was condemned to death( the punishment for sinning) as was every innocent offspring of these sinners . For shame I feel dirty just typing it... god made adam ,adam sinned , god made adam sin!
OK , now your jesus is sacrificed to redeem humans of this evil sin in this gods eyes . So why do you still have to die(remember this is punishment for original sin , you know the one jesus gave his life to pay restitution to your forgiving god... YET YOU ARE STILL BEING PUNISHED in conclusion your hole-e god is a blatant liar and created sin just so he can kill his loyal flock. Do you feel like a sacrificial lamb? Funny I don't feel any thing at all ..
Jesus said cowards unbelievers whoremongers idolators
And all liars will have their part in the
Lake of fire rev 21:8
I think atheist just love their sin
Homosexuelity, porn, lust, perversion,
Etc - your life will come to a end.
So will yours dipshit, everyones life ends, and the arrogance to say that you are special simply because you believe in the latest incarnation of Horus.
We dont love sin, we love ourselves we are not weakminded fools that need a magic sky god and a jewish zombie to make ourselves feel better.
We live our lives to the fullest becuase we realize we only get the one.
Man up, stop trolling, and just like when you realized your parents lied about santa clause, figure it out, they lied about god as well.
Having made up shit tought to you from a young age does not make that made up shit true.
is there a reason you are on this page? i dont believe many atheists cruise the christian pages blasting their views. you are the reason i cannot stand christians. i keep my opinions to myself, until ignorance is blasted in my face. hello, ignorance.
If there is no God, why would there be a fear of death?
Dying people hallucinate. Brains synapses firing all at once body and mind try one last ditch effort to stay alive, endorphins flooding the brain. Just a few reasons why a still living consciousness in desperation might become confused. Oh and lets not forget any primitve pharmocopia that he may been subject too. David Hume one of Scotlands greatest minds shouldn't be remembered for his last moment of weakness, rather his contribution to human knowlege.
Does it not take life to create life?
Darwin n Albert Einstein both believed
In a god - although not Christians -
They where smart enough to know
Where does the human eye come from,
The human heart, the brain, immune system,
Bone structure, skin, - trees that produce
Oxygen, etc etc etc etc - you have to be
Ignorant to believe their is no god.
Let's look at the 10 commandments
Lie 1x liar steal 1x thief Jesus said
Lust is adultry hatred Is murder from
The heart- idolatry , blasemy,
Other sins fornication, homosexuality
Envy jealousy, pride, filthy language,
Course joking, conceited , without love ,
Boastful, malice, stubbornness , etc etc
Heaven or he'll before a holy rightous god
He'll all day long - but god sent his Jesus
To die for your sins - repent n believe
Or perish-
Darwin lost his faith after his daughter died. He never beleived in god again.
Albert einstein, a jew by the way thats why he fled germany, believed because he could not explain all the universe had to offer.
Just becuase you beleive the quote mining doesnt make it so.
Well they could just as easily be seen as metaphors for the pain they faced as they died. Also. these quotations have been used on other religious sites apparently issued from the mouths of a whole range of famous atheists; you seem to be so insecure in your own arguements for belief that you resort to filling the mouths of dead men with lies.
Isn't it amusing how after someone's dead and can't defend themselves these claims always come up?
Actually David Hume said something that was profoundly impressive. He said that he was dying so his enemies are grateful. And Hume added that he was not dying so quickly and not dying in so much pain, that his friends are content too. A beautiful and courageous man who could see clearly even as he lay dying.
In a matter of a few decades at most, EVERY atheist on earth today - without exception - will find out for themselves whether or not there is a God. But by then it will be far too late for them! They will then discover also that self-delusion is no longer of any avail to them - for they will DIRECTLY experience the unvarnished and, for them, horrible truth of how things actually stand with them - rather than how they pretend to the world that it does! Yes - the self-deception that the disintegration of the body means a loss of consciousness and personality will be exposed as the crude lie it is! And the souls will then have to experience the FULL and UNREMITTING consequences of ALL their actions - for they CANNOT escape RESPONSIBILITY for them!
The sick thing is, B. Brown, that whether it happened or not, you probably hope it did.
Is there really anyone who hasn't read these quotes before? They're not interesting anymore.
THANKYOU!
Goddam. I thumbs down all the atheist stumbles almost as much as I thumbs down all the lolcats.
GET OVER IT. LIVE AND LET LIVE. What the hell does it matter to you anyway if someone believes in something?
In other news, check out my crazy ass blog of weird shit I get up to chocolate-snow.blogspot.com
Well you could turn off the "atheist" choice in your Stumble upon list. Live and let live :)
What does it matter to Christians if someone doesn't believe in something? Why can't I be left alone in my schools, on my streets, why are there preachers at my doorstep?
"What the hell does it matter to you anyway if someone believes in something?"
I'm atheist, but I also condone religion. I think religion is (in theory) a good thing. I was raised in a baptist home, through religion I was taught morals and ethics. What matters is that we have a nut case in the white house who is going to war on the notion that Jesus or God thinks we should. Thats what bothers me. I agree! LIVE AND LET LIVE! But the problem there lies within religion. Most religions dont believe live and let live. Religion, no matter which one, always leads to death, destruction and violence. I guess if you want to argue that point we could just look at the dark ages, what a wonderful time that was... Thanks Jesus!!!
All i'm saying is that its not particularly just religion that is the problem. The problem is that there aren't nearly enough humans out there who want to know the truth. Nobody wants to know whats really going on. Take your Prozac, praise the lord almighty, and pay your taxes. We need to question... everything, religion, politics, physics, without questioning we are just monkeys in a zoo. Doing what we are told, eating when we are told, and only living because we are being taken care of. When in fact we as humans are capable of so much more. Alcoholics dont need AA, and crack heads dont need rehab. Most importantly NOBODY needs god. We are fully in control of our lives, we have the ability to change our lives, work hard for what we want, and accomplish ANYTHING! We dont need some douche bag telling us that we are alcoholics and need to admit we are powerless to get clean, and we certainly don't need God or Jesus to get us through the day. You need a good heart, understanding, and high self-esteem. With those three things, nothing we set out to do will be impossible.
Sorry but i have to say that none of mankinds problems spawn from relig, that was just a way to control the minds of those who were over coming the fear of the more powerful. mankind developes a mind powerful enough the question therefore man begins to "GUESS" about the things which suround him/her time passes emotional attachments to those close by grow, death takes its tole. the question (No.1 question) arises about death and its meaning, the destination if any. BANG the unanswerable enigma that is the animate gone inanimate, and the last journey back to the planets resources. in the end some very intelegent person or people developed a convincing enough story about an almighty being aswering both where we came from and where we go afterwards. basicaly things spiraled downward from there, the story became belief, the belief became fact (in many differant forms) and the fact became a leash for the masses. there is no going back there is no change to be made its gone to far. there is nothing to be done as far as i see it ( and this is just my opinion)(badly spelt opinion). its not about who or what one believes its about what we do from here. there is no communication there is no understanding there is only death, we will all know soon enough who was right, or on the other hand we will just poof gone....be no more
Well said. Echoing Durkheim and Marx with your own individual slant.
I have a question about something said here. I'm not outright disagreeing with you, and considering how long ago it was written I suppose I don't expect to elicit a response. I very much agree with you that we are in control of our lives, which is why it makes me cringe when someone gets over a traumatic event or pulls themselves through a miraculous feat, or even makes a touchdown, and then thanks god and gives credit to "him." Anyway, I'm curious about what your take on this would be.. I was a heroin addict, in a pretty bad place (most heroin addicts don't live in kingdoms, if so, it all gets sold soon enough), and I tried tons of rehabs to no avail. Finally, I got on a methadone maintenence program and have been clean for four and a half years. I don't care what anyone thinks about methadone (but if you want to comment, at least do your research) because it worked for me, but it also took my really wanting to change my lifestyle in order for me to stay clean. I very easily could have decided to get back on dope or start using other stuff or any number of things, but I cleaned up and I give credit for all that to myself; I also greatly thank my mom and my wife. So, is this me getting clean on my own, or relying on a crutch (methadone/rehab) to fix my problem? I know how I feel about it, I'm just curious what others' take on it would be. Thanks.
I learned my morals and ethics by being properly socialized I am a good guy and i was raised in a non-religious household. I didnt need religion, i understand some do, but the general problem we atheists have, as we are mostly decent people, is that when we gather online like here or at the pastafarian website, which i wont name here cause thats advertising, we are constantly spammed by, you guessed it, christians, most other faiths leave us alone, and if the christians did to we would be so much more free time, and so few morons to deal with.
Most of us follow the live and let live ideal, we just never get left alone.
it doesn't matter to me if someone believes something...until it becomes a world movement that effects the very fabric of society, myself included. the catholic church has more power than god (joke intended) and control many, many aspects of MY world. this is an organization that didn't accept the finding's of Galileo until the 1990's...???...SO AS FAR AS THE CHURCH WAS CONCERNED THE EARTH WAS FLAT UNTIL LESS THAN 20 YEARS AGO and this is a group setting policy for me and my children. that is when i care! dumbass
I assume there are certainly people who haven't read these before. And in your arrogance I'm sure they're not interesting anymore, to you.
"I contend that we are both atheists. I just believe in one fewer god than you do. When you understand why you dismiss all the other possible gods, you will understand why I dismiss yours." --Stephen Roberts
The problem is that most gods aren't possible, because they possess some attribute that can not exist without rewriting the myth. And this revising of the myth must continue until, eventually, it becomes as vague as the basic monotheistic concept of God, so that there is no point in distinguishing one from the other. The basic concept of God, as far as we know, can exist, without redefining what it means. So I contend that Stephen Roberts has failed to comprehend that there is a fundamental difference between God and Thor.
"Is God willing to prevent evil, but not able? Then he is not omnipotent. Is he able, but not willing? Then he is malevolent. Is he both able and willing? Then whence cometh evil? Is he neither able nor willing? Then why call him God?" --Epicurus
Why call God "God" if he/she is malevolent? Because he is all-knowing and all-powerful. If that doesn't satisfy you, then you're just being difficult. Not to mention the possibility that a being that is everywhere at once just might have a different idea of what is "good" and what is "evil".
"Everything is more or less organized matter. To think so is against religion, but I think so just the same. When did I realize I was God? Well, I was praying and I suddenly realized I was talking to myself." --Peter O'Toole
What about light, magnetism, and electricity? None of these things are matter.
"The essence of Christianity is told us in the Garden of Eden history. The fruit that was forbidden was on the tree of knowledge. The subtext is, All the suffering you have is because you wanted to find out what was going on." --Frank Zappa
Actually it was the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. I guess the subtext there would be that all the suffering you have is because you think you can determine what is good and what is evil.
The problem is that most gods aren't possible, because they possess some attribute that can not exist without rewriting the myth. And this revising of the myth must continue until, eventually, it becomes as vague as the basic monotheistic concept of God, so that there is no point in distinguishing one from the other. The basic concept of God, as far as we know, can exist, without redefining what it means. So I contend that Stephen Roberts has failed to comprehend that there is a fundamental difference between God and Thor.
- Why is your God more likely or less likely then Allah? Or Thor? And what empirical evidence do you have of the difference between your God and Thor? Reread Robert's statement with this in mind.
Why call God "God" if he/she is malevolent? Because he is all-knowing and all-powerful. If that doesn't satisfy you, then you're just being difficult. Not to mention the possibility that a being that is everywhere at once just might have a different idea of what is "good" and what is "evil".
-As to why call him "God" if he/she is malevolent- you should ask yourself that. And to say that a person is just being difficult isn't an argument.
What about light, magnetism, and electricity? None of these things are matter.
- E = MC^2 <--- Look it up.
Actually it was the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. I guess the subtext there would be that all the suffering you have is because you think you can determine what is good and what is evil.
- Why create man with a reasoning brain and then smack him down for trying to think?
E = MC^2 <--- Look it up.
What about the ideas you are writing here. What are they made of? Much learning does not make your brain heavy, so they are not made of matter. Are we to believe that ideas are entirely non-existent, and therefore incapable of influencing matter? Then why are my fingers moving in response to your post? Remember the bible quote: "In the beginning was the word, and the word was with God, and the word was God." What is a word? It is an Idea, and so are you.
"What about light, magnetism, and electricity? None of these things are matter."
Light: E=MC^2. C is the speed of light. Energy is just MATTER times the speed of light squared. Technically you could say that the world is just organised energy, and be right also. Or, M=E/C^2
Magnetism: A direct effect of things inside a certain part of atoms. (Awkwardly, the school system doesn't tell what part(s) align...
Electricity: The movement of electrons/positrons which are both matter. The movement releases kinetic energy.
"Actually it was the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. I guess the subtext there would be that all the suffering you have is because you think you can determine what is good and what is evil."
I agree with both sentences. Whether the first sentence was factual or not (in realms of actual life, not in the myth).
"The problem is that most gods aren't possible, because they possess some attribute that can not exist without rewriting the myth. And this revising of the myth must continue until, eventually, it becomes as vague as the basic monotheistic concept of God, so that there is no point in distinguishing one from the other. The basic concept of God, as far as we know, can exist, without redefining what it means. So I contend that Stephen Roberts has failed to comprehend that there is a fundamental difference between God and Thor."
This is a problem of people's definition of God. For me, it's whoever/whatever created us. We could be a computer simulation for all you know!
"Actually it was the Tree of Knowledge of Good and Evil. I guess the subtext there would be that all the suffering you have is because you think you can determine what is good and what is evil."
Actually, I find the subtext to be that your god is no more "mature" than a child with a magnifying glass burning ants. He creates man without the ability to discern the difference between good and evil and then punishes not only Adam and Eve, but everyone to follow for doing "evil". Um, if they didn't know the difference between good and evil, they didn't know it was wrong to eat from the tree, even though god told them not to. Without the knowledge that was granted by the tree, they wouldn't know it was wrong to disobey the god and eat from it. Worse yet, your god is supposed to be all knowing, so he should've known Eve would snag an apple against his wishes. So, by placing the tree in there, he was preordaining mankind to punishment. And, since your god had knowledge of good and evil in advance, that makes him evil by every definition of the word (well, the mass infanticide is usually a good indicator of evil, but you dingleberries often need other examples.)
Now you can try to play this off with the rhetorical "you can't understand god's plan" bull, but sorry it don't fly. If it don't make sense, that means it's a lie. Period.
No, it was indeed the tree of knowledge, period. What most Christians & atheists don't know is that the story is symbolic & its primary purpose originally was to lead men away from Goddess religions. The Good & Evil part was added by the early Church editors. And it wasn't about learning their private parts were showing, either. The "nudity" that was suddenly noticed represents awareness, something those in power did not want the masses to have. The snake is an ancient symbol of the wisdom of medicine men, shaman, etc. & even today, it is used as the symbol of medicine, the caduceus. Archaeology has shown that the earliest religions revered women. In my opinion, this is because women were able to produce new life & man did not yet understand his role in that. When men realized their contribution to the reproduction of life, mankind began the transition into a religion that was patriarchal. After all, other than the life producing feat, men were generally bigger, stronger, more aggressive, etc. but revered the Goddess only because of the miracle of life women produced.
The story of Eden was a symbolic way of telling men not to follow a matriarchal religion. Of course, that it was symbolic has never been admitted, so fundamentalists take it literally. The apple tree is associated with matriarchal religions. Hence, Eve eating the apple given to her by the snake gave her wisdom & knowledge & she would no longer be submissive. It was a way to tell men not to allow their women to become learned. Merlin Stone is one author among many who have done extensive research on ancient religions & this theory.
And seriously, if one takes the story literally, doesn't it naturally make one wonder exactly what kind of omniscient, all-powerful God needs earth & ribs to create?
I'm not downing men here, either. Remember I am talking about early mankind & religion was, & still is, a method of controlling the masses.
By the way, I believe in a higher consciousness, power, source, or even God, if you want to call it that & my reasons for believing could never be anyone else's reasons, so I never bother to debate the existence of such. I'm not talking about faith, either. I do NOT, however, believe any religion properly addresses this source of consciousness & instead, religions collectively have built so many superstitions, myths & dogma around this source that I completely understand the reason atheists scorn it. I do not believe in sin, I do not believe in hell unless you want to call this hell & I do not believe Jesus or Buddha or any other avatar of religion is the ONE any more than the rest of us. I guess my belief could be, somewhat inadequately, summed up by this comment: Thou Art God. Grok?
I respect the atheists' views when not argued with emotion & sarcasm & I am saddened that religion gives all believers a bad rap, but I believe the marriage of science (quantum physics) & spirituality (non-denominational) is the only way to discern the truth. A great site that is a proponent of this view is www.meta-religion.com. If we don't tie the "mystical" with science, we will never figure it out. Science cannot explain miracles, yet they do occur. I don't understand why science doesn't JUMP on all the data surrounding near death experiences, miracles, etc. & start to analyze it. For example, what spiritual people call psychic powers is called ESP by science. Why aren't more scientists trying to prove or disprove it for once & for all? Also, check out www.victorzammit.com. This lawyer takes scientific opinions & reduces them to subjectivity the same way many atheists do religious views. It cannot be proven a God exists. It also cannot be proven a God does not exist. Period.
In my experience, many atheists are simply the other side of the coin. They argue subjective material just as Christians do. I think both groups need to open their minds to the true potential of mankind. Author Sam Harris is heralded by many atheists for his splendid reasoning about religions. What many atheists seem to have missed, or forgotten or never knew because they never actually read his book "The End of Faith" is that Sam is very open to the possibility of a higher consciousness. He just doesn't think mainstream & extremist religions are good for humanity & neither do I.
Peace!
First off, I'd like to compliment your analysis of the Garden of Eden. It's nice to hear an impartial explanation.
The merging of science and spirituality does seem ideal, but it isn't a direct path to truth. No one person would be able to hold their beliefs and factual knowledge equally. In the end, either science would be used to affirm religion, (Creationism) or religion would be used to affirm science.
A good argument and a decent sum up, glad to see an inteligent religious person. I have to say though that even in the early days of mankind, when the animals were worshipped, women were equal to men. They shared roles and food and almost everything equally. Also to look at it from a sociological perspective, in terms of studies, men and women have an almost equal level of agression. By which i mean that in perportion to population the number of women with high levels of agression is almost the same as the number of men that are very agressive.
Just felt like adding that.
A DIFFERENT IDEA OF WHAT IS GOOD AND WHAT IS EVIL???? How about a few million people in Somalia dying of starvation; How about the hundreds of millions who have died of AIDS in Africa (and all over the world), and the millions more who will just this year; What about 6 million Jews being tortured and executed?? (I'm pretty sure we all know this list can go on forever, and these are probably not even the best of the examples, seeing as how Christianity itself has caused a great deal of torture, pain, and death).
That's our point, or at least mine, when referring to Epicurus's quote. What sort of a god can intervene whenever he wants and chooses not to on these and so many other occaisions? If you'd like to respond that these are all a result of thousands of years of free will culminated into the world as it is today, then this, for some reason, is apparently the world as god intended it to be; I say this because, if it were to be different, he would've shaped it differently. Need I remind you that "omniscient" means ALL-knowing, not "all-knowing except for the future", and "omnipotent" means able to do ANYTHING, without confines of space, time, or any other concepts to which we here on earth must adhere.
When Voltaire was asked to renounce satan on his deathbed he said: "I think that now is hardly the right time for making enemies."
I often find myself wanting to believe in the God of the bible, but I just can't, I think I'll hold out and see if a much nicer one gets invented by someone.
Well said. We haven't too good a job so far though. Have we. ;-)
A simple thing to remedy, The FSM, if you regularly go to a library near your house look up our gospel, our god is so much nicer, and delicious, and as an added bonus we know who created him.
Give it a look and see if you like it.
Religion is institutionalized hear/say, perpetuated by ignorance, fear and peer-pressure.
> "Is God ... omnipotent. .... ..?" --Epicurus
First I wonder how the Jewish/Babylonian tribal gods (the Yaweh god and The El gods) ever came to be combined into one divine entity. Next, I wonder how this conglomerate became combined with a Greek-style "holy spirit" and a dead village carpenter/travelling hippy preacher from Middle Eastern antiquity. How does at least five supernatural entities become a Mono-deity?
Then, I wonder how people decided that this extraordinary concatenation of entities was "omni-potent"(all powerful), "omni-scient"(all knowing), "omni-present" (everywhere) and "omini-agape" (all loving).
Can anyone enlighten me as to how these characteristics became attached to this combination-god-figure? They don't seem to be consistent with the Christian version of the Jewish holy writings or even with the early Christian writings, even those which were a third century committee of blood-thirsty waring clerics decided were divinely inspired. So where did these ideas come from? And why do today's Christians consider them to be things which distinguish their (multiple) versions of a diety from the dieties, demi-gods, semi-gods, spirits and other supernatural beings created by others .
I also wonder how many of these characteristics are also supposed to be shared by the opposing dieties, demi-, semi- and hemi-gods listed in ancient Jewish holdy writings: Satan, Belzebub, Baal, Gabriel, etc.
Faith is cold as ice
Why are little ones born only to suffer
For the want of immunity
Or a bowl of rice?
Well, who would hold a price
On the heads of the innocent children
If theres some immortal power
To control the dice?
~Niel Peart, Rush - Roll the Bones 1991 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roll_The_Bones
There are those who think that life has nothing left to chance,
A host of holy horrors to direct our aimless dance.
A planet of playthings,
We dance on the strings
Of powers we cannot perceive
"The stars aren't aligned,
Or the gods are malign..."
Blame is better to give than receive.
Chorus
You can choose a ready guide in some celestial voice.
If you choose not to decide, you still have made a choice.
You can choose from phantom fears and kindness that can kill;
I will choose a path that's clear
I will choose freewill.
There are those who think that they were dealt a losing hand,
The cards were stacked against them; they weren't born in Lotusland.
All preordained
A prisoner in chains
A victim of venomous fate.
Kicked in the face,
You can't pray for a place
In heaven's unearthly estate.
Chorus
Each of us
A cell of awareness
Imperfect and incomplete.
Genetic blends
With uncertain ends
On a fortune hunt that's far too fleet.
Chorus
~Niel Peart, Rush - Freewill 1980 http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Permanent_Waves
Neil's social commentary has always been a breath of fresh air in a world gasping for truth. If you have never heard Rush's music, and are a fan of intelligent, masterful rock music, I highly suggest it. With a catalogue spanning over thirty years, you are bound to find something you simply adore. http://www.rush.com/ , http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rush_%28band%29
Why do you call yourself "free thinker" you have produced no original thought. Any mind slave can quote from sources where they find "truth ". This is not free thought, no more than someone coming here and quoting the bible. (even though I dig Rush, next time derive what the lyrics mean to you and write about that.)
if dna proves we are not all related, then how does the story of adam and eve make any sense! science is real and proven, religion is fairytale. if someone can find a single flaw in the bible, then who's to say that any of it has a basis of facts. its just a bunch of stories made up, to make people feel better about dying. After all, isn't death the greatest fear of all? the bible is a fairytale that got out of hand. its the same as someone believing vampires or dragons exist.
According to the Bible, Adam and Eve were the FIRST humans, but they were not the ONLY humans. This bothers me whenever people bring it up. Adam was created, then Eve, then they bore Cain and Abel. Cain killed Abel, and then Cain left to go to a city. Now, I doubt very much that in his lifetime Eve had born enough children to create a city, let alone sent them all away to live on their own. This means that God created other people, logically. So, the argument is null.
Now, according to the Bible, we are all descended from the family of Noah, because he and his offspring (and his wife, and their wives) were the only ones to be allowed on the arc. Therefore, if DNA does not corroborate the statement that we are all interrelated, then you can discredit the Bible.
I don't mind arguments for or against Christianity, or any religion. In fact, I enjoy them as I'm still trying to make up my mind. Just make sure that the argument you decide to make is a logical one based on the actual facts/tenets that you are trying to explain. Thank you very much.
we're all related in a very distance since. you can track mitochondrial dna (through females) back thousdands of years to see your own lineage, its pricey though
Thats because at one point in our evolution there was only a few hundred Homo Spapeins, they interbred with Homo Neanderthanlensis, a much more developed and spread out population (and yes at that point there were thousands of Sapiens) and that created mankind as we see it today.
There is loads of stuff in the bible that is 'way out there'
Look up Leviticus, check out the laws on mildew! you know those funny black spots you get on shower curtains or damp walls, or your sports kit when you left it in the bag too long.
Well apparently, if you get it in your house you should prey for it and if it doesn't go away you should tear it down and throw the bricks out of the city.
Oh and women on their Monthy cycle...the laws on the are ridiculous.
Also, according to the bible, if you marry a chick and shes not a virgin the marriage is null and void, so it went like this, "sorry mary, looks like you shouldnt have given it up to some traveling toolbag, now you have to lie and say god got you pregnant so old joeseph will still marry you, and create a long running lie factory that will directly result in the massacre of damn near billions over the millenia"
Being an agnostic, I still can't say that the bible is just one big fallacy, nor is it made to scare us about death. It contains stories of meaning, certain people's perceptions on events that happened, and some history.
The story of Noah and his ark for example. To build a ship to hold 2 of each specie would be a HUGE ship if it were possible to make. But in the story, it talks about how it rained for forty days, and forty nights. That is a long time right? Through translation, we learn that when that book was written, there was no word for 'many' and forty had the same meaning. Also, people all over the world (South/Central America) reported massive amounts of rain.
Even if you think the bible is a crock, try reading it. Understand that it isn't meant to be, but rather tell stories, educate and scare.
Somebody once asked the best question: Without god, would we have ethics and morality? If you want to be considered a 'free-thinker,' answer that in your own words.
Dude all you proved is that the bible is made up of stories stolen from various cultures. For example soddom and gommorah, a middle eastern astonomer witnessed a meteor striking the earth which explained what happend to those towns.
Jesus is just a retelling of the tale of Horus, the list goes on.
I am an atheist, but there is something I don't understand:
A huge part of x-ianity (and all religions) is based on community. Many websites dedicated to atheism seem to be giving their viewers an arsenal of quotes from famous persons. This can be used to bolster one's belief in "not-god" or "no-thing;" but further more it gives people a sense of being involved in a community. Much like going to a sporting event, where you can feel the "spirit of the crowd," the act of participating in ANY community is spirit building (or creating).
According to x-ianity this is God--the Holy Spirit--Community--the Church of God--and simply: church.
Most idiots on the street will give you some hokey explanation of what they think the Spirit of God is, but would you believe them?. (I sometimes wonder why I even bother to stop and ask for directions at a gas station.) However If you speak with a learned man, with regards to matters of religion, they will give you a more useful and realistic understanding of x-ianity.
Atheists have been duped by the media and unintentional public propaganda as much as bible beating x-ians who think that satanists want to eat their children.
"-Me",
I don't think your equation of "christianity" with "community" and "church" is a common one. In fact, I'd never heard of it before. I don't think my apparent status as "street idiot" is to blame here.
I agree that it is unlikely that atheists are immune to propaganda or the delusions consequent to suppressed information or lack of it. They may, however, be less swayed by it, especially those who have slowly come to the conclusion that the supernatural is unlikely to exist by virtue of prolonged deep thinking and ruthless sifting of the evidence. Some of us were once "brow beating x-tians", too. In fact, most of us moved away from, or through, some level of the religious beliefs prevalent in our community. Not all of us, of course.
In any case, I'm not sure of your point here. Is it to point out that everyone needs to relate to a community? There's no argument there. Psychological science has confirmed that in spades. Even freshly born babies need hugs, affection and human interaction in order to survive and thrive.
People tend to gravitate to those who share similar beliefs as this helps to confirm them as worthwhile people. Academics and professionals do the same thing. The solution to comfortable survival, however, does not require that the social support network be based on religious conviction or lack of it.
I always thought that a belief in God came through ignorance. In the past people made up stories that might explain the unexplainable. In this day and age of science and knowledge I am amazed in the number of folks that now only believe but shut their minds to the questioning of others. Believe what you will.....after all, there is Flat Earth Society.
"belief in God came through ignorance "
You cant believe the creation of even a single needle by accident or the probability is absolutely zero
But you can believe the creation or the design of the universe, human brain, etc....... are by accident
hence " belief in "No God" also came from ignorance and blank thinking "
Well you've just committed the lottery fallacy. The idea is that this sequence of events is one that took place by chance. Now consider a lottery winner. With a single ticket, he had a 1 in over 1,000,000 chance of winning (assuming its a fairly standard lottery). Now, somebody had to win. In fact, it would have been stranger if somebody HADN'T won. Now suppose the lottery winner decided that because the chance of him winning was so low, yet he did, he must have won because of some sort of divine intervention.
Silly huh?
This occurs all the time. Stories about the downright unbelievable, such as a snowboarder getting caught in a massive avalanche and emerging from it at the end unburied and uninjured (which I saw the video footage of only a few days ago on the Discovery Channel), do emerge, but just because these incidents are so rare, its not to say that they are in any way due to "god".
As for you pin analogy, that doesn't work very well. You're comparing a theory that suggests change over billions of years, so something that you seem to be implying should happen quickly (instantly?).
Over the same time period of billions of years you'll find that this pin did happen to just occur, from humans creating it. Think OUTSIDE the square.
But in any case, I also think you'd find that given tens of billions of years, an object resembling a pin would emerge eventually.
Now as for "belief in "No God" also came from ignorance and blank thinking", well no.
If you bothered to research the arguments of atheists, you would find that many of our arguments of proof against god rely upon scientific evidence (which admittedly, as empirical evidence, has the capacity to be disproved, but this is what gives it credibility). On the other hand, virtually NO religions make statements which can be directly proven or dis-proven because of their vague nature. That alone ought to render most religious arguments completely invalid, because they tend to appeal to one possibility out of many (one specific god from many, or even no god) without solid justification for doing so (the circular reasoning of the bible does not count).
"belief in God came through ignorance "
You cant believe the creation of even a single needle by accident or the probability is absolutely zero
But you can believe the creation or the design of the universe, human brain, etc....... are by accident
hence " belief in "No God" also came from ignorance and blank thinking "
Not by accident. . .but by coincidence
The religion and the movie industry thrive off of the same concept "Suspension of Disbelief". You can only believe it if you allow yourself to forget that it's bullshit. I've never known a dumb athiest but plenty of retarted Christians. Let the gays marry so they can suffer with the rest of us.
It's cerulean.
Is not, it's sky blue.
No it isn't.
Is too.
Is not.
i love satan.
there is no god.
only satan
To try and justify belief in either is moral and intellectual cowardice. Might as well cite the Easter Bunny. Consistency would be a good start.
Bloody hell you do not.......you wouldn't know Satan....if he fell on top of you....Satan is fucking pathetic....regardless of whether it is real or not.....Satan is so Passe.....fucking uncool.....go worship the bungee jumpin god......How can you love a Satan you have never seen.....if he exists he does not love you, so you can not love him....the word love is not in its vocabulary ....derrrrrrrWhat you really meant is I HATE SATAN which is a paradox cas you both hate each other....so therefore can not have any kind of relationship ...you both mean nothing to each other....so quit trying to say somthing that makes no sense....Jesus loves you....and one day you will love him
I do hope this is some clever rhetorical joke, without the myth of god there would be no myth about the devil, so if you are serious in some way i would equate you as dumber than the pope, and he has been quoted (actually quoted not quote mining, im not religious and they give us plenty of real things to make fun of) as saying that condoms will help spread aids. thats right the number 1 preventer of the diease will help to spread it farther, hes a brilliant old nazi isnt he, and yes he was actually a nazi as a child.
I will now state the only truthful thing one can about the existence and/or non-existence of a supreme being:
I don't know.
No one knows if there is or is not a god. Plenty of people have strong BELIEFS one way or the other, but there is the same amount of hard proof for the existence of a god as there is for its non-existence, which is exactly none.
Faith is belief in the absence of proof, which means that atheism is a much a faith as Islam. I think faith is a cowardly way to avoid admitting you just don't know something. Is there a god? I'll find out when I'm dead, or not.
Okay, I know I'll probably be flamed for this, but I want to reply and set some of these comments on a better path.
First and formost, there can be no proof of God except faith in his existence. However, if you start with the belief that God exists (an infinite, eternal, all-loving god), it won't introduce logical inconsistencies, unless you try to depend too much on dogma.
I do understand why I reject all other gods, and I still believe in God. Not that this will convince anyone else, but I'm not really trying to do so, I suppose.
Evil exists because we live in a finite universe. God already created perfect worlds. Ours was not intended to be perfect. We must evolve and spiritualize.
If you discount the parts of the bible that do not fit with the character of god (infinite, eternal, all-loving) you'll understand that this idea was put there by fallible mortals. The idea that god would blame us for being flawed is itself flawed. Of course he understands we're not perfect (yet).
Mind and spirit are more than matter. This will never be shown by science because science is the study of matter. Science must be united with religion through philosophy, or the world will not make sense.
The garden story has been altered in the course of human events, by human hands. It is flawed, and the character of God presented in it must be rejected.
There is no hell but the one in your mind. God loves you. Love your neighbor as a brother.
Joy to all.
"I do understand why I reject all other gods, and I still believe in God. Not that this will convince anyone else, but I'm not really trying to do so, I suppose."
I would assume then, that you reject all other gods because your holy book tells you to. Try picking a specific god that you reject and coming up with an argument for that god's non-existence. Then see if this argument could be used to argue the non-existence of your god. Remember, regardless of what god you believe in, there's another holy book to tell you that it doesn't exist.
"Evil exists because we live in a finite universe. God already created perfect worlds. Ours was not intended to be perfect. We must evolve and spiritualize."
I'm not sure why our universe being finite implies the existence of evil. Imagine a finite universe with only one living organism in it...can evil exist in this universe? It would be much easier to argue that evil must exist in an infinite universe. Also, how can one comment on what our universe was intended to be?
"If you discount the parts of the bible that do not fit with the character of god (infinite, eternal, all-loving) you'll understand that this idea was put there by fallible mortals. The idea that god would blame us for being flawed is itself flawed. Of course he understands we're not perfect (yet)"
I think I agree with some of what you said here: "this idea was put there by fallible mortals." I agree, we are fallible, and that the idea of god is a product of the human mind; that's right, god didn't make us in its image, humans made god in their image. I'm not sure what you mean by "we're not perfect (yet)." Almost by definition, perfection is unattainable.
"Mind and spirit are more than matter. This will never be shown by science because science is the study of matter. Science must be united with religion through philosophy, or the world will not make sense."
I've seen no evidence to support the claim that the mind is something non-physical. What I see is an area of human anatomy and physiology we don't yet understand. I've seen the historical precedent that when humanity is confronted with something we cannot explain, we attribute it to something supernatural (i.e. non-physical). Then, a scientist or group of scientists comes along and explains the phenomenon through natural processes (think lightning, earth quakes, the motions of the planets, etc). To me, this is strong evidence to support the idea that there is nothing supernatural about the world we live in, only stuff we don't understand yet.
"The garden story has been altered in the course of human events, by human hands. It is flawed, and the character of God presented in it must be rejected."
So...what holy book do you subscribe to? There have been many copy errors found throughout the bible. Even if we've not found a copy error in a specific passage, we cannot assume that it does not contain some error. By your logic, then, the entire bible is flawed, and the character of god presented in it must be rejected.
Miracles prove God is real. Some of you Atheists have poor exscuses for your lack of belief in them. What about the resurrection on Jesus? Do you call God a liar? Be not deceived God is not mocked. "Life without Jesus is death." God is common sense but faith is believing without seeing. How did we get here? The after life is unexplained in atheism. My,my,my your soul? What about your soul? Your comment about Jesus saying My God, My God why have you forsaken me? That was the agony he was feeling expressed to his father. But God gives us an answer to your question. John:17;18 "Therefore My Father loves me, because I lay down my life that I may take it again."No one takes it from me, but I lay it down of Myself. I have power to lay it down, and I have power to take it again. This command I have received from my Father." Without his death there would be no resurrection. The truth will set you free. May you find it soon.
Div.
hey dont mock god this book he wrote says hes the center of the universe
lol
You can't call a nonexistent entity a liar. Grow up and accept responsibility for your own faults
There is no such thing as either God/Gods/Goddesses or a soul. Prove it. With reason not blind inflexible faith. With every step science advances, religion/faith must crawl further into its corner and mewl. Religious faith is an anachronism in the twenty first century. True, science is not perfect and has problems, but it is so much closer than faith.
Do you have any actual proof of any of those events? Resurection, shroud of turin, made in 1300 by the guy that brought it back, proved by science, also its just a retelling of the story of Horus, an actually fun god.
The tree of knowledge of good and evil may have literally been the human brain eaten for it's aphrodisiac qualities and hence, the result was an overwhelming awareness of ones nakedness and an improved propensity for guilt due to (the side effect of) brain growth. Once human brains became large enough as a consequence of this practice to begin causing brain damage (due to the limited capacity of the human skull) the practice of elongating the skull began and as an effect of that some people were able to regain the lost gifts of esp that humans would have used for communication before our explosive brain growth. Skull elongation still happens in cannibalistic societies. Because of the increasing problems of brain growth causing defects the practice became taboo although secretly we must always know the terrible reason for our intelligence, resulting from sacrifice and suffering, and feel guilt bound by moral prescriptions regarding reasonable expressions of our desires. You have inherited this earth from your ancestors, you benefit from their chosen paths and with your sub-conscious guilt-memory you pay. Ha! I meet god a few times and I still don't believe. At a push I would probably choose mono pantheism with Hindu symbolic archetypes.
Both sides are right. Understand that and you will be enlightened.
Hear, hear! There is no wrong opinion. :)
No, just really stupid ones.
To all atheists, God loves you. Do not be among the many stubborn unbelievers who have gone before who may now be in eternal remorse. God is real. Just ask a dying atheist on his deathbed. Trust me on this one.
I don't have to trust you. I am a nurse and have found the opposite to be true every time. Athiests go peacefully and emotionally calm, the christian prays in ergency with family and hopes all sins have been accounted for and forgiven. A funny statement most christians say when one of thier own die" God called them home to be with him" this to me is admitting he can't be with them here!
I have seen Christians go VERY peacefully because they knew their work here was done and they knew where they were going. I'm not gonna argue with anyone because you see what you want to see.
A dying Atheist is more at peace with his death than a Theist.I was told this twice by a nurse and a Sister who worked at a hospice.Reason,they know life is over.The religious have doubts."Have I got the right religion",What about that sins I committed" "Is there really a God". Trust ME on this one.
Regan I would love to see citations for that one. Brain eating. Farm raised and wholesome. Hmm, on the other hand, it would explain Fundamentalism nicely.
The limits of my perception are not the limits of all there is to perceive.
True that why we have rational though, and are augmented by the tools science has provided. God always seeks refuge in areas of human ignorance. Until the that ignorance is no more. Leaving God/Spirituality high and dry.
You're all fags
I'll bet you eat shrimp, the bible says that is an abomination to shrimp eater.
why should the "urban legend" effect of some lie about a dudes dying moment be a basis to complain about an entire religion? You don't like religion, fine...you don't have to...but as i read, i see it isn't religion in general...it's a certain one...and most people's negative comments betray their prejudice.
Criticisms against one religion/faith can be equally levelled against all. So why single one out? Many great scientists advocate religion 'tis true. But the true genius does not. Oh please don't quote the hackeneyed old Einstein aphorism. Einstein saw the natural world as equating with god not as a personal/personified deity. It is simply wrong.
FUCK CHRISTIANITY.
Bye now.
There is more evdence to believe in an invisible teapot in a fixed orbit around our planet than there is in the "infallible" entity known as god. We are unable to comprehend god, by defination (god is omniscient, omnipotent etc, a concept that is supposedly beyond human understanding).
However, we have evidence of teapots that exist, they are tangible. We also understand that gravity causes smaller objects to orbit larger ones (though I know of some religons that will disagree here). Because of this prior knowledge we can assume that the aforesaid invisible teapot is more statistically probable than the existance of god, but no one is supposing that this is so
Science requires as much, if not more, faith than any religious belief. Any information that we can measure, test, prove or anything else is taken in through our five senses, which act as a filter. Who can say that our 5 senses are perfect interpreters of the information. No one can transend our five senses to prove that, and so we take it on faith.
Thank god I'm an atheist.
If the Christian god were real and the only true one god I wouldn't want to be serving him in the afterlife. The guy is a dick, after all how many hundreds of thousands of people has he killed according to the bible and how many tens of people has the devil killed? I feel if my human instinct gets the best of me and I repent to the super natural I will be hitting up the devil for salvation not god, talk about the lesser of two evils.
"But now look around you, would you really believe that an all powerful God would be anything less than ruthless and terrible in his judgment of man? Wars, plague, poverty, drugs, and crime, and pornography, and abortion, and sodomy... The mark of the beast is all around us. Didn’t you think that someone, someday would come to clean it all up? Full with a righteous fury? We have abominated ourselves and we have devoured his precious garden." - Spiritual Genocide
Too many rely on what people have written to dictate what they believe. I feel much better about believing in something greater than myself, though I would never use religion to power my beliefs. They are mine, and mine only, and the relationship between this Ruthless and Terrible God and myself is entirely private. To be honest, I feel safe believing in something that is so perfectly capable of being the ultimate evil, and the ultimate good.
More power to what you may, or may not, believe in. :)
I never did understand why god created satan. Was this before he was omnicient ?
Lucifer was an Angel. He wanted God's position. God's sent him to hell.
Actually the story was closer to he was jelous of the new creation and the attention it was recieveing, he never wanted to be god, he wanted his love more than the humans and believed that they did not deserve it.
Why I know That There is a God and That He Loves Me
A Personal Testimony.
Not too long ago doubt was creeping into my head about the Lord and then a miracle happened.
Three years ago 100 members of my church were enroute to a bible camp in the Blueridge Mountains of Virginia. They were traveling in a chartered bus. As they sang hymns, Satan was up to his old tricks. You see, the bus driver was an atheist alcoholic socialist and that day he was filling his coffee mug with vodka. As the bus wound up through the switchbacks, the driver got progressively drunker. Then it happened. It was that day that changed this poor sinner's life forever. Entering a particularly tight switchback, the besotted driver finally lost control of the bus and it plummeted 1500 feet down into a ravine where it exploded into a fireball incinerating the flock. The only survivor that day was a young boy who was thrown from the bus by his father seconds before it hit the bottom.
This young boy suffered severe brain damage from hitting a rock head first and will have to wear a football helmet and drool cup for the remainder of his life. But his survival proved to me that miracles do happen because God does exist and loves me. The Lord used that accident to bring me back to his flock.
Hallelujah!
Praise Jesus! Just open your eyes to his miracles and you will see them everywhere.
Man! We'll all know when we are dead!
But wait, according to atheism, we'll never know! That sucks.
If man was created in gods image why do christians want to be reborn? What image do they take when reborn?
we were created in God's image. But, in the Garden of Eden, Satan came in and tempted Eve and she in turn tempted Adam. That was the fall and where sin came in. we were NOT created sinners in the beginning. it all happened then. we Christians ask Jesus to come into our hearts to forgive us of our sins. every human being on earth is a sinner. Christians are forgiven and still fall, but we should try our hardest not to. But, Satan is still around tempting everyone. we do not get a new image until we get to Heaven. you know I would think that you all would've read the Bible before. it's just surprising.
Christians say jesus is alive so what did he really sacrifice to himself?
Mankind is being punished for what the first two humans did in the garden of eden imagine what god will do when millions screw up in heaven.
there is no screwing up in Heaven. there is no pain, tears, sadness. only rejoicing. in the end, God's plan will be finished and Heaven will be the place of peace. another thing, has anyone on here read the Book of Revelation? do you not see how God's word is coming true? things are getting worse.
No, YOU will be punished for YOUR sins.
Question: Would you have any friends if they knew the things you thought about them?! Every thought, word and deed will be brought into judgment before the Holy God of heaven! "It is appointed unto men once to die, but after this the judgment." -Hebrews 9:27
The fact that you are not in the burning flames of hell even now is testimony of the mercy and longsuffering of God. Who would open their arms to you and offer forgiveness after finding out the wicked and perverted things you have thought and done?! None but one.
Jesus died in your place on a roman cross 2,000 years ago. "Believe on the Lord Jesus Christ and thou shalt be saved." Acts 16:32
There are over 300 prophecies Jesus fulfilled during His first coming. Read Isaiah 53 and see over 30 prophecies alone of the suffering Messiah written 700 years before He came!
Why has the most sought after body never been found?
Why would the Jews to this day claim his body was stolen after death?
Why would His disciples be willing to die for their eye-witness testimony that they saw the risen Christ?
Why would you reject the one who bore your sin and punishment that you might be saved?
I LOVE THIS SITE....
THE ONLY DIFFERENCE BETWEEN IS WHEN WE WERE LITTLE WE BELIEVED IN TOOTH FAIRY,MONSTERS AND OTHER IMAGINARY STUFFS,,AND WHEN WE ARE ADULTS THEY ARE JUST REPLACED BY THE NAME"GOD"......
And how do you know this? Or is it just something you want to believe?
I would rather believe and embrace God, and die and find out I was wrong, than not believe and die, and find out I was wrong.
What if you believe and embrace god and find out you were wrong? The closest things I can believe in that I would consider god is Quantum mechanics which is the theory that we are all part of a supercomputer which is more plausable to me because science has backed this slightly with the fact that our entire world is pixelated. Or that aliens with extreme intelligance stuck us on here. Or whatever triggered the big bang to me these theorys are far more plausable then any religious views. Religion breeds more racism , biggotry , ignorance , homophobia then any other institution in the world. Religion keeps mankind in a bondage to fantasy and keeps people from reality and when people say religion is good and think that the words tell me lord ill do whatever you say is a good thing you should take a step back and relize since there are no gods accually talking to you this void and space is filled with people with their own greed and agendas there is nothing you can possibly say that can justify how much war bloodsheed and sheer ignorance religion breeds is part of a divine plan that's nothing more then a shitty excuse that a child would use yet it does a preety good job keeping people in line when the puppets need somebody pulling the strings for them.
How do you know that racism, biggotry and ignorance are wrong?
You chicken
Let me just pose these questions:
First let me say,I know and believe with my whole being God is real, but for the purpose of this discussion;
What if I were wrong? What would that mean?
That my life was lived with love,joy, and comfort in hardships until my life had passed.
Now, what if you're wrong??? what would that mean for you and all you influenced with unbelief??---- something to think about.
it would mean that i lived a life full of joy, love and happiness, same as you. but my sunday's were free to sleep in and watch cartoons.
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